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Post by ashahalasin on Apr 9, 2009 15:27:18 GMT 10
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Post by Missmanagement on Apr 9, 2009 16:19:34 GMT 10
[Wait up - so you say you want varied gigs (which i agree with), but then you say you don't want a doom band between 2 fast bands? Erm, wouldn't that be the very essence of a varied gig? By saying "the styles should compliment eachother", what you're really saying is that the styles should be similar, thereby negating your original statement about wanting varied gigs..... The 2 main problems are these: 1. that if you have too many of the same style of bands on one night, people get bored and wander off. On the flipside of that.... 2. If you have variation in the styles of bands, people wander off anyway (or don't even bother to show up) because, as we all know, it would be a crime punishable by death to be seen watching (much less enjoying) a band like say Four Dead, after having just watch a band like say Aeon of Horus In short - people have short attention spans and closed minds I think a doom band between 2 fast bands isn't going to compliment, it's going to create a slump in the general mood of the night. I wrote that mostly in jest anyway, that's why there was an LOL at the end . 'Fast' is not a style. Therefore 2 fast bands aren't necessarily similar. Therefore 4 fast bands can compliment eachother while still being varied. 3 fast bands with a really slow one just before the headliner really kills the mood for me. It's like stopping for a nap in the middle of sex. If your music is good and you are entertaining, people will want to watch you regardless of what style you play. It's your job as the band to lure the crowd, not the crowd's job to make you feel better about yourself. If you are engaging, no one will wonder off. We could also start hiring people to stand outside the mosh pit with paintball guns and a spotlight, "anyone is free to leave when they want, of course, can we just ask why?"....
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Post by olmate on Apr 9, 2009 16:59:02 GMT 10
I get some of what you say, and in some ways it's fair enough. But what i think is lacking these days is peoples willingness to allow themselves to enjoy something different to what they would normally watch.
Different styles have different positive elements going for them, and if more people were willing to appreciate those different elements and different perspectives that a variety of bands bring to a show (as opposed to fast fast fast fast) i think the scene as a whole would be far better off and who knows, they may even discover something new that they like!!!
I DO agree that bands need to be engaging, that's for sure. but if the crowd is too wrapped up in their game of pool to even look at the stage, you can understand why the band would rather be someplace else. Band/crowd energy is a cyclical thing, and if one side doesn't respond, the energy disappears
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Post by Missmanagement on Apr 9, 2009 17:31:45 GMT 10
quote author=olmate board=discussions thread=243 post=1564 time=1239260018] I get some of what you say, and in some ways it's fair enough. But what i think is lacking these days is peoples willingness to allow themselves to enjoy something different to what they would normally watch.
Different styles have different positive elements going for them, and if more people were willing to appreciate those different elements and different perspectives that a variety of bands bring to a show (as opposed to fast fast fast fast) i think the scene as a whole would be far better off and who knows, they may even discover something new that they like!!!
I DO agree that bands need to be engaging, that's for sure. but if the crowd is too wrapped up in their game of pool to even look at the stage, you can understand why the band would rather be someplace else. Band/crowd energy is a cyclical thing, and if one side doesn't respond, the energy disappears
[/quote]
Agree.
I didn't mean every gig should be fast bands, it was just an example.
I don't know, I just keep doing what I do. I make sure I have fun, my bands have fun, and hopefully the punters have fun and then the next gig will be even better than the last. It's worked so far. Gigs are supposed to be fun, for everyone. If you're not having fun, you're doing it wrong.
I see what you're saying about Band/crowd energy is a cyclical thing. I've found this to be a real problem when watching internationals. Makes it hard to get into it when everyone around you is sitting down. That's another story though.
But at a local level, Punishment, CHUD and Unholy Vendetta, I know for a fact, they just want to play, whether it's at a gig, or at jam, whether people watch it or get into it, they don't care. No doubt it's better if people like it, LOL, but if they're not playing gigs, they still jam every week, they're hungry for it. And they'll play their best, even if there's only one guy there to see them and we let him in for free, LOL. The drive is always there regardless of who is watching.
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Post by olmate on Apr 14, 2009 13:52:44 GMT 10
All of which is good. The fact that you want to put on shows is commendable, and the fact that the bands you mention want to play shows, is even better. But while those bands may be happy to play to 4 people, i can pretty much guarantee that a band who has just driven 8 million hours to get here from where-ever-the-fuck will not share that sentiment!!! More likely they'll just go home with the shits and take the first opportunity they get to slag the shit out of the scene here and tell every band they can think of not to play here coz no one shows up! And sadly they'll be 100% right, because unfortunately, people seem only too happy to come up with what can only be described as pretty feable excuses not to attend shows.
Ten years ago it made absolutely no difference whether a place had top notch toilets (which i've never actually seen at ANY canberra venue anyway) or whether the carpet was spotless, or whether the venue was spacious or not. Let's face it, RockApe was a shithole and suffered from all off the afforementioned problems, but people went there regardless because it was almost always a good night of copious drinking and supporting local bands, no matter who was on the bill, and back then THAT WAS WHAT MATTERED!! And as a general rule, it was pretty well accepted that while there are sometimes "dirty old dudes" at gigs (as well as some pretty festy chicks i might ad!), you were just as likely to have your arse checked out while walking down the street or by some old dude at your place of employment as you were at a gig. It just didn't matter.
It just shits me that a scene which used to be alive and very healthy, seems to be collapsing pretty rapidly due largely to a certain level of elitism, laziness and pettiness which just wasn't around a few years back
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Post by ashahalasin on Apr 14, 2009 15:05:55 GMT 10
Does anyone actually not go because of toilets and space though? I can understand them saying they aren't a fan of it, but does it actually make people think 'well, maybe i won't go tonight, the toilets are rather dirty'? God bless the dirty old men, i'll be one, in many a year to come.
I don't think the scene is collapsing from elitism and pettiness, i'd say it is simply from a lack of interest, a lack of awareness and the general malaise that people treat the canberra metal scene with.
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Post by Missmanagement on Apr 14, 2009 15:30:41 GMT 10
Do you really think its collapsing pretty rapidly? Or are you just having a general rant? I think it's shitloads better than say 3-4 years ago. At the end of the rockape, it was really dismal for a while. Times change. So you have to run with it and do things a little bit different. Bands from interstate might need to be hyped up and promoted a bit before they play here. The rockape had a capacity of 80 something people.. So a normal show there might have looked big but actually was only 40-50 people. The "elitism, laziness and pettiness which just wasn't around a few years back" has always been around!! As far back as the Armoured Angel days and definitely in the rockape days. It's a direct side effect of dealing with humans..
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Post by olmate on Apr 14, 2009 15:57:29 GMT 10
Does anyone actually not go because of toilets and space though? I can understand them saying they aren't a fan of it, but does it actually make people think 'well, maybe i won't go tonight, the toilets are rather dirty'? God bless the dirty old men, i'll be one, in many a year to come. I don't think the scene is collapsing from elitism and pettiness, i'd say it is simply from a lack of interest, a lack of awareness and the general malaise that people treat the canberra metal scene with. Unfortunately yes, i've heard the dirty carpets/smelly toilets excuses many times in the past from various people. Funnily enough, on a couple of occasions i've actually run into these very same people stumbling between some of the better known Civic nightspots, not seeming to mind the fact that the toilets in any of those "classy" establishments are usually and inch deep in human filth. I'd be tempted to agree with ya on the lack of interest thing. Except for one thing. Last time Psycroptic were here, the gig was huge!!! Which made me wonder - where the hell are all these people at all the other gigs? There are obviously still plenty of metalheads in canberra, so why are the not going to shows regularly? Sure Psychro are great and they don't play here very often, but still. Even the fetival gigs which take place and which realistically should have pulled great crowds, were pretty piss poor to say the least. I was very surprised at how quiet the last Chaos ACT was and i know for a fact that the promoter was not the one to blame. Like you say, it seems to be a general malaise in the scene, but it's that very "general malaise" that i reckon is gonna kill the scene completely. And you just watch the whining and bitchiness and fingerpointing when that happens!!!!
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Post by olmate on Apr 14, 2009 16:03:38 GMT 10
Do you really think its collapsing pretty rapidly? Or are you just having a general rant? I think it's shitloads better than say 3-4 years ago. At the end of the rockape, it was really dismal for a while. Times change. So you have to run with it and do things a little bit different. Bands from interstate might need to be hyped up and promoted a bit before they play here. The rockape had a capacity of 80 something people.. So a normal show there might have looked big but actually was only 40-50 people. The "elitism, laziness and pettiness which just wasn't around a few years back" has always been around!! As far back as the Armoured Angel days and definitely in the rockape days. It's a direct side effect of dealing with humans.. Both really. I DO think it's steadily turning to shit and I'm having a rant about it. Not doing it to attack anyone in particular, i just wanna put it out there so that maybe a few people might take it on board and start attending a few more gigs and getting Canberra's reputation back on track.
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Post by Missmanagement on Apr 14, 2009 16:08:02 GMT 10
Does anyone actually not go because of toilets and space though? I can understand them saying they aren't a fan of it, but does it actually make people think 'well, maybe i won't go tonight, the toilets are rather dirty'? God bless the dirty old men, i'll be one, in many a year to come. I don't think the scene is collapsing from elitism and pettiness, i'd say it is simply from a lack of interest, a lack of awareness and the general malaise that people treat the canberra metal scene with. Depends how disgusting the toilet is.. You guys are all doom and gloom! It's really not that bad! 'Scene's collapsing' etc.. LOL.. We must be attending different gigs. I haven't been to a gig that pulled only 4 payers. My worst was 41 payers, a couple of years ago. That was a bit sad. LOL. The worst I've been to was probably Infernal Method at the Holy Grail when they (finally...) released their album. I think that was 11 payers or something. It was a bad time to be putting on gigs in Canberra.
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Post by Missmanagement on Apr 14, 2009 16:16:05 GMT 10
Both really. I DO think it's steadily turning to shit and I'm having a rant about it. Not doing it to attack anyone in particular, i just wanna put it out there so that maybe a few people might take it on board and start attending a few more gigs and getting Canberra's reputation back on track. Agree it can always improve and more people at gigs is always a good result for everyone involved.
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Post by katietonia on Apr 15, 2009 16:40:03 GMT 10
Not really justifying the fact that people don't watch, but sometimes people just like to drink with good music in the background. Admittedly you could do it at home, but at least they still pay entry. This is true, I go to a lot of gigs where I have absolutely no interest in any of the bands playing, just to support the local scene..... and the venue through drinking of alcoholic beverages. Can just hang out and see friends I don't normally see.. and sometimes be surprised when a band is interesting that I wouldn't normally have pursued listening to. That said I prefer a similar genre or sound for all the bands on a night.
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Post by katietonia on Apr 15, 2009 16:41:13 GMT 10
Does anyone actually not go because of toilets and space though? I can understand them saying they aren't a fan of it, but does it actually make people think 'well, maybe i won't go tonight, the toilets are rather dirty'? God bless the dirty old men, i'll be one, in many a year to come. I don't think the scene is collapsing from elitism and pettiness, i'd say it is simply from a lack of interest, a lack of awareness and the general malaise that people treat the canberra metal scene with. Actually yes, when I know a place is full of dirty old men and the toilet is filthy I am less likely to go. It might sound odd but I do think about that sort of thing when considering leaving the confines of my house. ;D
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Post by ashahalasin on Apr 15, 2009 17:20:55 GMT 10
Yes, but you are a female. The lot of you are crazy.
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Post by katietonia on Apr 15, 2009 19:44:23 GMT 10
Yes, but you are a female. The lot of you are crazy. Oh so I should have hidden my "gender" on here it seems.
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